Finding Creativity Through Structure with Textbook Maneuver on the Virtual Sessions 9/18/25

Michael, better known as Textbook Maneuver, joins for an insightful conversation that explores how science, structure, and creativity intertwine in his musical journey. Growing up with a love for music but rooted in a professional career as a chemist, Michael shares how his analytical background influenced his approach to learning and producing. His artist name reflects this very methodical nature – diving into textbooks, experimenting, and developing a disciplined foundation before evolving into his current cinematic electronic sound.

 

He discusses his early piano lessons and the pivotal role of receiving a piano as a gift, which shaped his lifelong connection to music. Michael reflects on balancing influences from classical composers like Satie and Ravel with the raw energy of metal, punk, and progressive rock, which all feed into his eclectic style today. His EP Strike Joy and full-length album Adrenaline Slip mark milestones that not only capture his evolving sound but also symbolize his mission to create music that inspires positivity and introspection.

 

Throughout the interview, Michael highlights the challenges of standing out in a saturated digital landscape and the importance of trademarking and branding as an artist. He also shares his fascination with building unique sonic textures through software, synthesizers, and improvisation while acknowledging the perfectionist tendencies that sometimes slow creative flow. His vision for Life Science Records reflects his DIY ethic and a long-term goal to nurture other artists.

 

Michael’s story is one of curiosity, persistence, and innovation – blending scientific discipline with artistic exploration to forge a unique identity in electronic music.

 

Topics

0:06 – Origins of the Textbook Maneuver name and scientific background
5:35 – Describing music style in three words and cinematic influences
8:21 – Creating Strike Joy EP and discovering his sound
13:30 – Inspiration and naming of Adrenaline Slip album
19:07 – Early musical background and family piano story
23:37 – Lessons on discipline, perfectionism, and songwriting methods
28:12 – Transition from analog piano to software-based production
33:28 – Reflections on production complexity and influences from pop teardown
38:44 – Key electronic inspirations from Gary Newman to Boards of Canada
49:03 – Hobbies, daily life, and vision for Life Science Records

 

Connect with Textbook Maneuver

Bandcamp: Life Science Records

[Darran]
Hey everyone, welcome back to another episode of the DJ Sessions Presents the Virtual Sessions. I’m your host Darran and right now I’m sitting in the virtual studios in Seattle, Washington and coming in with me all the way from New Jersey we have Michael aka Textbook Maneuver. Michael, how you doing today?

Doing great man, how you doing Darran? Awesome, well thank you very much for being here with us today, really appreciate it. Had a little pre-show stuff going on beforehand, some last minute important phone calls that I had to tackle and get out of the way, but I really appreciate you being here and being patient with us and getting started today.

Wanted to give a shout out to any of your viewers and fans that are watching right now, thank you very much for tuning in with us today. So Textbook Maneuver, or we’ll call you Michael throughout the interview basically, but you just started, you’re a new artist and you know first and foremost what’s the story behind your artist’s name, Textbook Maneuver, where did that come from?

[Textbook Maneuver]
First of all, thanks for having this platform, thanks for having me on man, this is awesome. I became a professional musician recently, but I’ve always been into music growing up and everything and my professional life, I’m more of a scientist. I went to school, did a lot of science stuff, I do science stuff at work and everything, so whenever I’m learning a new subject, I’m reading textbooks or just reading stuff.

So when I was first getting into this, I’m like I gotta figure out how to do this. So I just, the way my brain works, I ended up reading a bunch of stuff, I took some classes at a local college and I was like, I’m doing a textbook maneuver here. So it was kind of like my typical way of learning something new, new piano a bit growing up, I played a little bit of bass guitar growing up, but never anything professional, never really got that great at any of that, but just started learning and reading and taking classes and the name worked for me.

I knew I wanted like a two-name thing, I kind of like when artists have two names or two words in a name, I should say, so that one worked.

[Darran]
You know, yeah, no, it is kind of hard picking names, I was kind of giving you a little bit of history before pre-show, you know, my background and you know, my first show that I started out with was Phantasmagoria and that name actually came from an event that my dad wanted to throw one of my brother’s concerts when I was a kid. And I mean, I was in my teens probably, I think it was maybe 11, 12 years old, somewhere on there maybe. And that name stuck with me for so many years that 14 years later when I produced my first broadcast show, the name of the show was Phantasmagoria, you know, and I don’t know why that popped through my head, why I wanted to do it.

But you know, then I had Northwest Extreme Sports, I had Image Nightlife and then came back and you know, when you’re branding something, I thought to myself, oh gosh, I gotta make t-shirts and logos and websites and this is 2001, 2002, you know, so tools aren’t really readily available to do that, isn’t that like they are now? But all that branding, I said no, we came back and in 2005 we just umbrellaed it all under ITV and then we had ITV Nightlife, ITV Music, ITV Short Films, you know, things like that. So it made it a little easier, but yeah, picking a name that you’re going to last with, that stands, that has to stand with you and resonate and that’s your persona, your character.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Yeah, it’s a mouthful, it’s a pain in the ass to type maneuver every time I type maneuver, but also I want to make sure it wasn’t used anywhere, right? Yeah, that’s the other thing, you got to check, so many artists names have been taken.

[Darran]
Well, you know, that’s the one thing, it’s funny, I had an incident, speaking about getting names taken, I had an incident in 2018 where I, there was an event, we were doing an event, somebody went online and they looked us up and they said, oh, the DJ sessions and they go, is this you? And it wasn’t us and so I looked and I kind of did a little bit of research into it and there was a typo basically on this website and I contacted the website, I contacted the artist, contacted the owner because I figured it wasn’t the artist’s fault, it was the owner of whoever put the online calendar together and it wasn’t met with a well reception. I was trying to be plausible like, hey, I’m just trying to investigate, figure out what’s going on, that was some, let’s say, not so friendly retort comments back and that forced me basically to go and trademark my brand and we have our national copyright going in place and we’ll be doing our international trademarks as well, those are going in place, they take time to do and money, unfortunately, but it’s what I tell a lot of DJs out there that starting their artists are in the business, it costs $50 at the state level to trademark your name and at least you have that, that’s a start to say you had it first, if somebody uses it forward, you can always go back to that original trademark, I mean, you can put it, once you put it out there, you’re kind of protected as using it first, but pay the 50 bucks and trademark your name, at least at the state level and that lasts for five years, very easy to do, you don’t have to go national or international necessarily, not yet, but at least you’re starting the process and there’s other things, I have two business degrees, so I’m kind of savvy on starting up businesses and small businesses and working with entrepreneurs and stuff like that, so yeah, trademark your name, check it, name check it, good tip on those, but I love your backstory though, that’s pretty awesome, you know, textbook maneuver, you know, if you could describe your music in three words or less, how would you describe it?

[Textbook Maneuver]
That’s tough, it’s kind of, I’ll say eclectic, all right, so it’s a little bit, it’s a lot of genres together, so eclectic is one word, okay, textbook maneuver itself, I’d say it’s definitely chill, okay, and I think it’s kind of cinematic, because I’ve had a lot of people that listen to it, lots of friends or family, but even non-friends and family and I have this one brother-in-law, he’s like, I’ve had the strangest dreams listening to your music, you know, so it’s stuff like that and then I’ve had other people, you know, reviewers and stuff, they say, well, it sounds like it could be used in a movie, so there is this cinematic element to it and that’s intentional, no doubt about it, like I’m trying, I can’t sing, I’m trying to learn to sing, right now I can’t sing, but I love emotional music and usually that comes from the singer, at least for me, it comes from the singer, so I’m trying to do that through the voicings I’m using with synths and stuff, so I’m trying to make it feel emotional, sound emotional, but without any lyrics, so it ends up being kind of cinematic, but I like that kind of music, I like when the music, the song can take you on a journey in your mind and sometimes even when I’m composing, I come up with the song title based on what I’m feeling as I’m writing it, you know.

[Darran]
You know, it sounds like your genre, I haven’t had a chance to listen to your whole, all your music yet, but definitely sounds like it’s right in line with the type of style of music, if I were to produce, would be just that cinematic, earthal, pan, synth type stuff that was very affluent in the 80s, it’s why I love Stranger Things and the soundtrack to that, or when John Carpenter soundtracks, you know.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Yeah, exactly, that kind of stuff is awesome.

[Darran]
Or what I like really, really, really, really, really like, you know, that kind of stuff there, because it’s just kind of what I grew up listening to in the 80s, and when my brothers had a studio that’s kind of playing with the synthesizers and the rack mounts and all that, it’s kind of what I liked, and I listened to a lot of down-tempo, ambient, what could be definitely background noise, movie soundtrack stuff already through Soma FM, I always give them a shout out when I can, the Groove Salad Station by Soma FM, it’s like, if anyone knows me really well, it’s like, what’s going to be on Darran’s tombstone, Soma FM, a solar panel playing Soma FM 24-7, you know, come to me, you’re going to know that’s what I’m grooving to when I’m in the beyond, you know, but no, that being said, you know, it’s definitely sounds like we’re, we definitely have that same taste in there. Now, you just launched an EP, Strike Joy, back in 2024, December 2024, not too long ago, and you know, what was that like, building up to put together your first EP?

[Textbook Maneuver]
Yeah, you know, it was wild, and I had just started learning how to use one of the DAWs, I was using Logic, and I was working with the loops that are in there, I don’t know, you might not be familiar with that, but there’s loops in there that are, you know, royalty-free, you can play around with, and I was doing it in the evenings, in my sunroom, so all the crickets and frogs are out there, and you know, I’m telling you, the stuff ended up getting into my brain, because one of the songs that’s promoted now, Nocturnal Musings, it sounds like, you know, night creatures with some really crazy EDM drumming and stuff mixed in, so I did that one, and you know, it wasn’t, you know, I have a musical background, meaning I took piano lessons, I understand music composition, and you know, melodies and harmony, and how to put structures together, so I was definitely tapping into that as well, so it came out pretty good, I was like, this is all right, and then I did two more, and I’m like, all right, screw this, I’m putting this out, you know, and I was always a fan, and then two things, I’ve always been a fan of EPs, some of my favorite bands, sometimes their best songs are on the EP, rather than their full-length, right, and that’s usually when it’s hidden gems. These songs all sounded similar, because of the methods I was using, so they fit together nicely, and then I was also composing some of my longer form, the cinematic stuff, and it sounded enough like textbook maneuver to me, but it was different, so I said, all right, I got to keep these three separate, they’re also my origin, the first ones I did, so that’s why it came together that way, and I always felt, you know, I work in a corporate world type situation, so we just have mission statements, and you know, it’s kind of good to come up with a brand, as you were saying, what is your statement, so I always said, you know, if I put out music, I want it to kind of make the world happier with my music, right, I’m not going to put out black metal, that’s going to, you know, scare the crap out of people, but I like black metal, so I’m not against black metal, but it’s like, all right, I want to put out music that’s going to make people happy, make people chill, because you have to pick a genre, right, or not, and we can talk about that later, but I said, all right, well, you know, people try to strike gold, people try to strike this, I said, I’m going to just try to strike joy, you know, with music, can I strike joy with music, so I came up with that title for the EP, and I just put those three songs together, they’re kind of really short form, fun tunes, and definitely separate from the longer form album that I put out.

[Darran]
You know, a lot of people, the art of doing EPs or full-length albums is not, it’s not necessarily customary in this day and age, because everyone’s looking for that single and a single and a single and a single, you know, and so it’s like, like we were talking pre-show, you know, about how back in 2017-18, my marketing teacher was saying there was a million videos a minute being uploaded to YouTube, a minute, million videos a minute. I mean, that’s 60 million videos an hour, and they’re like, wow.

[Textbook Maneuver]
It’s even more than that now, it’s insane.

[Darran]
And you think of music creation and everything, how much stuff is being just thrown out there now that people, there’s not really a gateway, because you can create your own label and say, here I am, and put it up to here, here, here, here, and that whole game has changed now, especially when I talk with a lot of label owners, because, you know, at one point, we were toying around with launching our own label here at The DJ Sessions, even having our own music store, our site is built for it, and I kind of shied away from that, because I don’t have time to be an A&R person and listen to hundreds and hundreds of tracks and decide what I want to put in, what I don’t, what sound we want to be known for, all that fun stuff. We are launching a new music section, which we’re looking to incorporate music from people in there, and a new radio player for us as well, so that’ll be nice, and we can feature music, and we are syndicating other shows and things, but I mean, it’s, that’s a whole, that’s a whole full-time job in itself, you know, and then there, you know, I just, I wouldn’t have the bandwidth for it.

[Textbook Maneuver]
So it’s a double-edged sword, because I call it frictionless. You can start a label, if you’d learn how to do it right, that’s why I took the music business class, so I could learn how to do it. Once you learn how to do it, you trademark everything, you make sure everything has its codes and metadata, so it’s a double-edged sword, because you, everybody can, you know, it does take time and effort, you got to do it right, but then it also means a lot of people are doing it, and it’s really, how do you, if it’s an ocean of music, and maybe your song is less than a single drop of water, probably a one-tenth of a single drop of water, and it’s gonna land in this ocean, how do you know it’s gonna make a splash, like it did?

[Darran]
Yeah, exactly, and then, you know, obviously money is a big factor that can come into play, and help out in certain areas, you know, to do that, but you know, it’s awesome to see you’re taking on that challenge, and coming out first, hitting it hard with an EP, you know, and then following up with that, just earlier this summer, you released Adrenaline Slip, you know, the name behind it, so you strike joy, and now you have an Adrenaline Slip, what’s, is this like a racing album, or what’s the sign behind that, like, if I’m gonna see it in Fast and the Furious, and put it in my car, and you know.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Stories to this one, too, for sure, well, first of all, the songs, when I was composing them, got long, and longer, and longer, and if I think about my music origins, I always had music playing in my house, my parents’ alarm system was the radio’s always on, if somebody breaks in, they’re gonna hear the radio, think we’re here, I’m not kidding, my mother used to literally do that, she would leave the radio on all the time, but that being said, they had like Beatles records, great vinyl collection, right, Beatles, Jim Croce, Fleetwood Mac, all this stuff from, you know, that people’s parents of my age listened to, but good stuff, and then my brother and his friends, they got into more of the classic rock, prog rock, and that’s when songs started to get really long, so that was seeping into my subconscious from, you know, my brother’s influence there, and then I got into more of the heavier side of that, and then definitely got into more metal, and punk, and all of that, but the reason I’m bringing this up now is, I think I’ve never forgotten that origin stuff, and I’m still drawn to the complex music of the 70s, when the songs were long, they were trippy, a lot of synthesizers, right, phenomenal drumming, great lyrics, great vocals, so when I was composing, I didn’t care if the songs were long, even though I knew Spotify and all this other stuff that’s out there now do care, but I didn’t care, and I still don’t care, right, so I said, I’m going to put out music that I really enjoy, and for me, it’s going to be me, if I like it, I’ll put it out, if I don’t like it, I’m not putting it out, you know, I’ll just, and so I have like a whole library of stuff that’s not going out, because it’s more just, you know, you have to write a lot of crappy songs to write one good song, it’s sort of what you learn pretty quickly.

[Darran]
You almost just answered one of the questions I was going to ask you, and I love it when people do that on my show, you know, and I don’t know, because I didn’t send questions out earlier, but yeah, I was, we’ll touch on that in a moment, but thank you for bringing that out, but yeah.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Yeah, yeah, so the song’s got really long, right, and then, so I said, you know what, I’m going to put out a full length, right, so I’m going to pull out a full length, and I’m like, this is going to be a debut, you know, and I don’t know if this is going to go anywhere, but maybe in 30 years, this becomes my debut, right, and I don’t think I’m going to ever be a famous musician or anything, but I also, I’m a history buff, so I know sometimes finding legacy things, even things that get found that people have never heard of, like this guy Nick Drake has this huge renaissance to pass probably 15 years, but, you know, a lot of people forgot about him for about 20 years, so what if there’s a moment like that, so then I literally started saying to myself, what are some of my favorite debut albums of all time from artists that I still like, whether it’s electronic music or prog or whatever, so two of my favorite bands, their debuts are still my favorite album by them, so one’s called Adrenaline and one’s called Slip, so I said, that phrase actually goes well together, so that’s how I ended up calling my album Adrenaline Slip in honor of these two artists that I love, and that’s their debuts that I listen to in full every year, from start to end every year, at least once I’ve listened to those two albums, and that music sounds nothing at all, one band is the Deftones, but they’re pretty hardcore, Adrenaline Slip sounds nothing like the Deftones, and the other ones is more of a smaller band from the New York area called Quicksand, and they’re more like a post-hardcore band, again sounds not very emotional, but sounds nothing like Adrenaline Slip, so that’s how I came up with the name Adrenaline Slip, and it ended up being like 73 minutes in total, it’s a long album, I probably would have made it longer, but I was reading, I read a lot, that’s my textbook maneuver, so I think I was reading, I think it was Rick Rubin’s book, and his book’s kind of interesting, it’s mostly like advice and sayings, almost like poetry in certain spots, but he has this one thing that he put in there, it said something like, you need to stop working on a project, so you can start working on your next project, so that’s how I decided, because when you’re doing this, especially with what I’m realizing, how you can put music together, you can literally work on a song forever, there’s always, you’ll wake up in the middle of the night going, oh did I get that, did I get that pan exactly right, or should I use a different synth on that part, or is the bass drum coming in too quickly, am I using the right snare, at some point you have to stop, yeah, yeah, yeah, so but it’s a long album, I think it’s worth to listen, one of the songs is actually a four-part suite, which is kind of cool, so again it goes back to my prog thing, but there’s a lot of synths, especially like the 80s stuff, like Gary Newman and all that stuff, I love that stuff too, so it’s definitely, that’s why when you said give me three words to describe your music, and it could be dangerous, because in this day and age, if you don’t fit in one genre, it’s very hard to market yourself too, yeah, yeah, so right now I’m considering myself an electronic musician, but I think people from different styles could probably get into this album.

[Darran]
Nice, nice, and you know, did you, you mentioned you just kind of got into this recently, do you have a musical background other than your family listening to, like you mentioned Fleetwood Mac, and you know, the stuff I grew up with, when my dad was, even though he’s turning 89 this year, he still was young at heart and listened to a lot of stuff from the 70s that I grew up with, I think of the classics that are great, I mean, you know, but other than that, were they musicians or into music other than listeners?

[Textbook Maneuver]
No, my father recently told me that my grandfather was a good singer, but I never knew my grandfather, he died before I was born, so there’s really, so here’s the story on how I got into music, besides listening to music, so I have friends that own the carpet business in the Bronx, and part of that business was, I think it’s the main distributors of the carpet, they used to give out pianos as a thank you to the owners of the carpet businesses, so this family is like one of the most generous families I’ve ever met, they gave my family a piano, and I wouldn’t, yeah, I’m getting a little bit, it’s a kind of emotional movie, but I would not be making music if I didn’t have that piano, I think, I don’t know, but that’s my origin, so my parents are generous, they said, you know, he’s taking to it, he’s improvising, he’s doing all this crazy stuff on the piano, so my mother, my sister and I took lessons, and I’m the only one that stuck with it, my sister hated it, she quit right away, my mother stuck with me for a while, so she started playing a little bit, but I basically never stopped, so I took lessons, and that’s when I got into classical music, and I learned about music theory, and I would listen to classical, I still listen to classical, but things like Satie is what I really liked, which is sort of almost like stuff you’d hear at a spa, but I mean some of the melodies that Satie comes up with, incredible, and Ravel’s another one, but I also like like Beethoven, to me he’s like the heavy metal guy of classical, and Mozart’s like the pop star, right, so I just did that for a long time, and then when I was getting into high school, I had other priorities, including like metal and punk and stuff, I’m like I don’t want to play the piano anymore, I want to rock out now, right, so that’s when I started learning bass, so I kind of gave up on piano, but then when I moved out of my parents’ house and moved to New Jersey, I grew up in the Bronx, so when I moved out to New Jersey, I brought to my parents, like take the piano, you don’t want to use it, so they lent me, you know, that piano from the O’Connor family, I was able to bring with me to Jersey, it’s still alive, I gave it to my niece, because I upgraded, I bought myself a new piano, but my niece still has the original O’Connor piano, well I call it the O’Connor piano, and she still plays it, which is cool, but anyway, long story short, when I was, you know, I was a bachelor living out in New Jersey, when I first moved out here, and I found a local, I said, you know, I’m going to start playing piano more, so I found a lady who was originally from Russia, and her husband was a pretty well-known opera singer in Russia, and then they moved to the U.S., so I ended up taking lessons with her, and she was really like, almost like hitting my hand with a bamboo stick, so she got me really disciplined, and I really started working on my scales, and my chord progressions, and you know, so that was in my 20s, I probably spent, I think probably about three or four years with her, and she would bring me to recitals, and it was a weird scene, because I’d be in the front row, and I was, you know, an adult, right, and it’s like, all like little kids, and I’m sitting in the front row with my sheet music, getting ready to go on stage, and I would, I get, I get massive stage fright, so even to this day, I get really nervous playing live, so so yeah, so it’s kind of good to be a bedroom studio musician nowadays too, if you have stage fright, but eventually I’ll make it out on stage.

I think that kind of answers my musical background,

[Darran]
so I kind of always wanted to learn a theory, but that definitely, I think, would scream a big yes, you do come from a musical family background, that’s awesome, yes I do, and I’m glad you really, again, you did it again, and I really love it when people do this on the show, you don’t know the questions that are coming up, not what’s coming up, you led right into my next question, because I liked when you’re talking about the teacher, who would almost hit you with the little bamboo reed, I was going to say, the question is, how much of a perfectionist are you, and I think that just rings in, why you, why you are, why it comes into play, because you were trained to be that, you know, to do that way, and think that way, to hit it, and sometimes, like you said earlier in the conversation, that can be a little, it can be hard to put something down, because there’s always something you can do as being a perfectionist, I know this being a, if you’re in astrology in any situation, I’m a Virgo, because people think I’m a Leo, because I’m on the cusp, but I’m a Leo Virgo, and I’m like, okay, it has to look this, this way, and you know, and that’s, that’s, there we go, you know, and you know, how to know when to take a break, and step away from something, like you said, start a new project, I like that quote, you mentioned from Rick Rubin, a very, very awesome, awesome producer, good, good, wise producer, obviously is very successful, and I’ll throw,

[Textbook Maneuver]
because this is really important too, when I was starting out, and you know, it’s not that long ago, but that, and I don’t know Jeff Tweedy at all, I don’t even know that, I can’t remember which band he’s from, but it’s one of the indie pop bands, or indie rock bands, people listening are probably like, how could you not know who Jeff Tweedy’s from, but anyway, Jeff Tweedy wrote this book, a really short book called, How to Write One Song, so I was like, I’m buying it, so, so I got that book, and that book, if anybody is listening, who’s starting out, that book also helps you get discipline, and there’s like little exercises you do each day, and it’s actually a really good book, because he talks, but it’s short, it’s like 100, maybe 150 pages, but really good, even you become a person that starts to study words more, like how do you come up with a textbook maneuver, or adrenaline slip, or song titles, so there’s some techniques that I read in that book, but literally, he said this, he’s the one who kept writing, it’s like, there’s so many, you have to keep, you have to be willing to write a crappy song, you have to be willing not to be a perfectionist, and you should be able to work on something every day, and even there’s one quote in there, where he’s like, look, you don’t think you can do something in five minutes, next time you don’t think you do, go sit at your instrument for five minutes, and see what you do, without any plan, and just sit there for five, and I’ve actually written some songs that were based off of those five minute moments, so yeah, there’s a lot of, I think reading, I think we said reading is fundamental, but I think there is something to reading, some of these folks that have lived it, and gone through it, and now they’re, you know, they’re tropic gems, you know, in some of these books.

[Darran]
Definitely, he, Jeff Tweedy’s with a band called Wilco.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Oh, Wilco, that’s right, I should have known that.

[Darran]
Doing the beauty of the internet, and pulling stuff up while we’re watching, I don’t have anything AI reading, isn’t farming out questions, that would be a really cool concept, I’d love to put my interviews through AI, and have stuff pop up, as people are talking about it, and like, over here, or have a research assistant, maybe they’re listening, and popping up stuff for time, but nope, it’s just me. I had to go up and look that up, because, you know, sounded familiar, but wasn’t sure who that was as well, but yeah, I mean, definitely, I think reading is key, education is a key, you can never stop getting enough education.

I’m always constantly learning more and more stuff, I sometimes, when I stopped a few months ago, to take a look at like, everything that I do with my brand, with my show, with my series, and I was like, wow, I have like, 14 different people that I talk to, to do different things, but I’m the center point of it all, so I know enough to have, I know enough to be dangerous, when I get out of that realm, I hire somebody, you know, because I don’t need to know everything, because there’s somebody else out there, that’s an expert in that thing, and I can go, hey, I got this far, but you know, even if it was like an attorney, I’ve had some things where I’ve had legal matters, and I’ve gone to attorneys, and like, Darran, with all the work you’ve done, you would have burned through my, I would have burned, you’ve burned through the $5,000 retainer you would have given me. I’m like, oh, really? I just did $5,000 of the legal work?

Yeah, and probably knowing that what you’re going down, you’re probably going to do another 10 to 15 balance, and you can handle it, because you’ve already got this far, you’re going to be able to handle all this. I’m like, really? Like, yeah, I’m like, all right, cool, I learned something new, you know, like my dad always said, you know, the difference between him and the mechanic is, the mechanic just knows how to do it faster.

The mechanic read the book, the mechanic goes in to do it, but he does it 200 times, he can do a little faster. It might take me a little longer, but guess what? I learned something along the way.

And now, next time I do it, it’s like, I can get in there and do it. You build that competency or, and confidence to do something, which then, you know, says, I can do this, and I can do this, you accomplish, you accomplish, and you get through it, and you look back, I remember the first paper I ever wrote in college, I thought I was amazingly awesome, because I got an A on my first paper, an English 100. I wasn’t even a college-level class, and I said, see, this college stuff is easy.

I know what I’m doing. I think the teacher gave me an A because I turned something in. And, you know, two years later, I’m writing, you know, 20-page thesis, and, you know, like, I can have a rough draft, like, ready to go, here you go, and ready to go with those, and felt, oh, this is this writing stuff, this is what it’s all about, but I look back at that original paper and oh, I didn’t know anything.

This is great. That’s what I got. I got the A for effort, A for her writing, but yeah, but, you know, are you, you mentioned how you obviously started with analog gear, starting with the piano, but now moving into software production.

Do you, are you more hardware, software, mix of both?

[Textbook Maneuver]
The stuff on the albums are, it’s all software, but the origins are all analog. I haven’t set up my home studio enough where I have enough microphones, but it’s off camera, but my Yamaha piano’s right over there, so I usually improvise on the piano for a while. I write down the notes on sheet music, and then I’ll bring it over to the laptop and then, you know, I have a, this is a MIDI player behind me, so I’ll just redo it there, what I did on the piano.

So yeah, right now it’s all, it’s all software-based. I do have an acoustic guitar, and I still have my electric guitar, so I am planning on miking up a bit more, but again, I have to read a couple of textbooks about how to do that first, so, but I’ll be doing that as well soon, so that’ll be, future projects will be a lot more analog.

[Darran]
And you mentioned using Logic earlier on. You’re still using Logic to this day?

[Textbook Maneuver]
Yeah, that’s, that’s the one I learned on. I never tried anyone on, you know, it’s the only one I ever learned. When I went to the local college, that’s what they recommended trying out, and it works great.

Oh, I love Logic.

[Darran]
I used to work for Apple for years. I was a trainer for Apple to train people how to train, how to use the Final Cut software and Logic. Train, not make.

Didn’t teach people how to make movies or how to make music, just how to use the software and get around and navigate through it, but I always loved the sequencer in the back, and that’s kind of how I got first introduced to making music on a computer was using Fruity Loops.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Oh, yeah, sure.

[Darran]
Fruity Loops 3, and basically, you know, that was kind of fun, just playing with that, and then later on in college, I bought two pieces of Roland gear, MC-505 and an SP-808, and MIDI synced those two together, and would sit there at my friend’s house with the sequencer on one side and the sampler on the other, and kind of make tracks, you know, and make some fun stuff, and it was really two pieces of cool little gear that, you know, at the time was, I mean, I think each one of those together probably cost me about $2,500 to $3,000, you know, and this is 25 years ago, hardware gear, but I liked it because you could manipulate it all in real time, but then when I saw what Logic had on the back end, I was like, this is dope, plus it comes with that awesome royalty-free library, and some of the secrets they’ve said that some of the acoustics and how they did sound design is kind of, and there’s a whole

[Textbook Maneuver]
software universe of like, all the companies that have formed for inserts into that software, you know, so that’s still like, it’s almost like the tree, and then all the stuff you can add to that tree from other companies, and then you can really make unique sounds, and this is the source, I think, is how you manipulate, and then it’s sort of, to me, it’s just becoming an instrument, right, I’m not an anti-analog person, I’m not an anti-software person, because to me, just like singing, like your voice is an instrument, how you tune that software or what plugins, what combinations you do, you know, that gives you a unique sound, and I track all of that too, I have a notebook, because it gets so complex, so I’d like for each track and each part of my song, sometimes they’re, you know, 30 tracks long, and there could be, you know, a few plugins on each track, I have that all notebook, so I could, and then I am an old school type of, I love the music, like where, you know, like Fleetwood Mac has a certain sound with their bass guitar, or The Who, the way Keith Moon drummed was, you could hear a Who song when you hear like Keith Moon drumming, because you know it’s Keith Moon, at least before he passed away, so I like some of these unique sounds, I’m like, wait, that’s my instrument, I’m going to use that in other songs, and then, so when you listen to the album Adrenaline Slip, there are certain sounds that get played throughout the whole album, and I have one song in the opening track, pretty much every chord progression you hear throughout the album is in that track somewhere, so if somebody really becomes like an audiophile and really wants to study the music, they’ll see that my first song called Birds, there’s elements of every other song in the album in that song works, sometimes it might be a sound I made, but sometimes it’s a chord progression, sometimes it’s sped up faster than in the song, where that chord progression is the entire song, so everything I’ve done on album was very strategic and intentional, but all of it was also based on improvisation, so it’s kind of this weird economy, it’s, yeah.

[Darran]
I recently had a couple things pop up on my timeline, social timelines here recently, and one of them I thought was so interesting, I was just, I had to watch it, a guy goes in and he literally dissects the BGs staying alive, and I mean, he takes it down, you know, you say you got 30 tracks, he takes down bit by bit and isolates each one and goes, this is what it originally sounded like, this is what it sounded like once they did this, this is what they sounded like when they put it together, and how it all, and the layers behind that whole song was like, whoa, like, and this is, this is in the 70s.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Yeah, that’s when they were, they were literally cutting tape with a, back then you would use like a razor blade and tape stuff together, yeah.

[Darran]
And I mean, it was just like, holy, I won’t swear on the show, because we get syndicated and we can’t have swear words from SEC. But I mean, I was just blown away how the guy just dove down and just put it all together and goes, and here’s what you get when you put all of this together. Because, I mean, each sound, I mean, I was, so I like when a series pops up and looking at what it takes.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Oh, exactly. I’m not a huge fan of like a very pop, pop music, but when a song becomes a major hit, right, even if it’s probably been orchestrated by a studio and, you know, there’s hired songwriters for that, that pop star. One of the professors I had that said, you know, you might not like that song.

It might taste like candy that’s going to run out your teeth from a musical point. But do that teardown. You’re going to, that song is very complex, sounds simple.

But if you try to reverse engineer it and do a cover of it, it’s, there’s usually some really cool stuff behind it. So sometimes I do that just to kind of learn different techniques. But yeah, I can’t listen to it on a day-to-day basis, but I can appreciate the effort that goes behind it.

And then there’s, of course, a ton of money in marketing behind it as well. But it’s interesting because doing this has also opened up my appreciation of styles of music that I never really appreciated. So it’s been a really good experience the past year.

[Darran]
And speaking of styles and music that you never would have gotten into or maybe thought of technically listening to, do you sometimes make music completely out of your own genre that never gets released? I mean, you mentioned making, I won’t say the crap, just the stuff that maybe never sees the light of day, the vault. Maybe it will see the light of day one day, but do you ever experiment in other genres?

I know you mentioned a pre-show, you have two aliases that you do.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Yeah, I have a few. So there’s another alias called Distance Major. And that one, I had to change the name because I can’t remember the original name, but the original name was a different artist.

So actually, I have it in a notebook, but I cannot remember fully the Distance Major origin story. But that one, it’s all software-based, similar. But to me, it’s slightly more rock, but probably closer to like a prod rock or almost like a light chill rock.

I’m not going to say it sounds like Steely Dan, because the musicians on Steely Dan, there’s no way I sound like Steely Dan, but it’s that chill vibe. Maybe it’s at the Tiki Bar, it’s okay, that style. So I don’t know if that’s rock or I don’t know what that is, but that’s Distance Major.

It’s not textbook maneuver, it’s not fully cinematic like textbook maneuver, and it’s not proggy like textbook maneuver. And then I have another one where I’m like, you know what, dance music is fun to make. It is fun just messing with the BPMs and crazy synthesizers and just getting your freak flag on.

So that I put under something called Psytech. And that’s all caps, there’s not a lot of vowels. So it looks almost like an EDM type artist name.

So I’ll have an album coming out from them this year as well. And then, since I do like classical music, and I love the piano, I will have an album that I’m actually going to put out under my own name, my full name. But I do like electronic music now too.

So what I’m planning on doing with that one, I’m going to put out, it’s probably going to be either five or six songs. So you’re going to hear acoustic piano with maybe some violin and some other classical elements. And then those same exact songs, again, but with a lot more electronic elements later on top.

So you’ll have two versions of each of those songs on the album. So that I should have done by December. I have about five songs finished already on the classical side.

But I haven’t manipulated them into a electronic layer yet. So that’s pretty cool. So to me, that’s a little bit outside.

I never thought I’d put out classical music. And then just because I’m trying to learn, I’m learning, sort of what you said with the beaties, I’m just trying to learn how other genres work. So I like old school country music, like Johnny Cash.

And then when those artists started putting drums, some of the drum beats that those drummers, and I don’t know the drummer’s names, I’m still doing my research there, but there’s some drum beats that they’re doing that I’m like, it’s almost like jazz, but it’s with a country acoustic guitar. So those I’m trying to learn, because maybe they’ll inspire me in how maybe I make some beats.

[Darran]
You sound like you have a lot of influences. When it comes to electronic music, which sounds kind of a new venture for you, new area for you, who’s been your biggest influence when it comes to your career in that branch of what you’re doing in your creative branch, is there something that stands out really to you in electronic music that would be, I really heard this, saw this, like what they’re doing and went, beeline or something?

[Textbook Maneuver]
Yeah, I would say the first pure electronic music artist that I got into was Gary Newman. He had a song, Cars, which was a huge hit, but he put out so many albums. His music is pretty simple.

His early stuff is much simpler. He always played with a real drummer. That’s the one thing that he always did.

He always had a real drummer. I think he’s kept the same drummer for many years too. So he’s definitely one.

Growing up in the 80s, you could not get away from things like Depeche Mode and all of that stuff. So I didn’t really buy that music at all, but it was on like, I go out, my buddies go out to, I guess they were bars more than clubs, but you know what I mean? You go out and that’s the music that’s playing.

So that you end up getting into, and we’d go see cover bands and they would be playing all of that 80s synth pop, whatever you call that. And some of that stuff is pretty good. And actually, I definitely appreciate that stuff more now, a lot more than I did when it first came out.

I’m like, I can’t listen to this. I’m a metalhead. But that’s definitely an influence.

And then I’m telling you that prog rock from the 70s, that’s not considered electronic music, but those synthesizers, those players, the guy in Genesis, Tony Banks, incredible. Rush, I mean, Geddy Lee’s the bass player, but he was also the synth player. And then even when Van Halen put out that song, Jump, without the synthesizers, that would not have been with it.

I mean, that’s the hook right there. So I think that for me personally, I always loved synthesizers. And then being a pianist growing up, it was very easy to move right to a synthesizer.

I’m like, wow, I can’t do this on the So that’s it. But then if we go more to the modern era, I got into some indie rock in the 90s. So Death Cab for Cuties, a band, they don’t do anything electronic, but the lead singer did a project called the Postal Service.

Okay, with pure electronic musician goes under the name. I don’t know how to pronounce it, but it’s d n t l. I don’t actually don’t know how I’ve ever tried to pronounce that.

But it’s d n t l. So Benjamin Gibbard, and d n t l, d e t l, he was just writing purely, like really like avant-garde electric sounds. Like when you listen to his stuff, it’s really, sometimes you don’t even know what a melody is.

It’s very glitchy, really cool stuff. I love it. So him and Ben, he started literally mailing, this was back in the day, but it wasn’t that long ago.

It was like 1998, 1999, when they worked on it. He would mail samples to Benjamin Gibbard through the mail. And then Benjamin Gibbard would get these tapes, and he would try to sing over them, add a little bit of acoustic guitar, mail, literally mail them back.

And that’s how they collaborated. And that’s why they called it the Postal Service, because it all was done through the mail. You know, right now you would just put up on a file share drive, right?

Gosh, I hope they were backing things up before they sent them out. Yeah, so they put out this album in 2000 called Give Up. It is awesome.

It’s synth, pop, got really good emotions on it. They have a couple of guest singers. There’s a female singer who sings on a couple of songs.

Really, really incredible album. That definitely said to me, wow, there’s some really good modern electronic music that I would like. So I was never really full into the electronic dance music.

That’s the part I feel like when you go clubbing to a rave, I just, you know, I can’t speak to that, because I really don’t know that world at all. But after the Postal Service, I started listening to other artists. So there’s one called Uncle, that’s from the UK.

They’re also a collaborative effort. Really, really cool stuff. And they have a ton of remix albums.

So I started listening to their remix albums. And then I started, within like the past year, as I’ve been doing what I’m doing, and people have heard my stuff, they’re like, you sound like Aphex Twin. So I’m like, all right, let me listen to Aphex.

I’m like, wow, Aphex Twin is pretty freaking cool. I’ve never really listened to them before, but they’re awesome. And then there’s another band called Boards of Canada, which is from the UK.

Phenomenal. I had never heard of them. I thought I knew a lot of stuff out there.

Boards of Canada.

[Darran]
They’re one of my top.

[Textbook Maneuver]
They’re one of my definite top.

[Darran]
Definite top. You’d probably love Groove Salad by Soam FM. Check them out.

They have the old classic Groove Salad, because they’re celebrating 25 years. I just heard one of the first newer commercials. They don’t do commercials.

They’re commercial free, but they always have a little, hey, we need some money to keep stuff running. But they’re doing a 25 year anniversary, but they have classic Groove Salad, a station from like 2000 to 2013 or something like that. And then 13 forward for the last 12 some odd years.

I just listen to the latest stuff, but there’s some good stuff in there that I just can’t get away from it. Like I said, anyone that knows me, if you’re into Boards of Canada, definitely a staple that plays a lot. Massive Attacks in there a lot.

Okay.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Yeah. I like Portishead I got into. I like that.

[Darran]
You know, Thievery Corporation. That’s where I found out about Massive Attacks. Yeah.

I did like them. Yeah. Zero Seven.

Tons of stuff’s in there. Zero Seven, I love. Yep.

That’s another one. So you’re going to love. I’m glad I tuned somebody on to Groove Salad.

Yeah, absolutely. You know, when you mentioned Gary Neumann with cars, though, what sprung in my head, is there was a disc that I own. I might still have it somewhere in my closet.

I moved a couple times and I like got rid of stuff, but I had this disc and I think it was the 20 most record at the time when I bought it was the most 20 most recognized electronic music songs of all time. And one of the, I think Gary Neumann cars was in there. Electro set.

How does it feel was in there? But one that was like, I think the first track on there was the Donna Summers. Yeah, I know what you’re talking about.

What’s the name?

[Textbook Maneuver]
Come on, Gary. It’s not Is It Love? It’s something like that.

Yeah. And it goes up. There’s a long verse that goes off.

[Darran]
I feel love. I feel love. I feel love.

I feel love. I feel love. I feel love.

Oh my God. I’m getting shivers just singing it right now.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Yeah, no, that’s a good song.

[Darran]
Such a killer song. It’s so, so awesome.

[Textbook Maneuver]
It was a big Studio 54. You can imagine people being on whatever they’re on.

[Darran]
Whatever they’re on, whatever they were getting back then. But I remember that and that was really the history of electronic music up until that moment. They had as far as they could.

And electronic music, when I bought that, it was still coming out as a popular genre. It wasn’t as big as it is now. I saw the lineup for Coachella this year.

And even they’re saying now electronic music is outweighing rock music for all the festivals that are going on now. Coachella’s staged huge, like 30-something percent electronic music with 27% or something rock music and all that fun stuff. That’s just the trend.

That’s the way it’s going. And it’s a world phenomenon now with electronic music. So awesome stuff there.

Do you listen to any podcasts or live streams? Yeah, I listen.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Yeah, it’s not electronic music stuff. There’s a guy out of New York, his last name’s Stone. He does what’s called the New York Hardcore Chronicles.

Because I’m also a DIY guy. I grew up in the era when punk bands would just form. And some of those kids actually lived on the street.

They literally were homeless. And they would borrow each other’s guitars and put out albums. And that became what’s known as New York Hardcore, which still exists as a genre or sub-genre.

So this guy, Stone, he does the New York Hardcore Chronicles. And it’s a very similar long form to this, to what you do, interviews a lot of times some legendary guys. And he has a live chat feed.

So that’s why I recommend New York Hardcore Chronicles. Because he doesn’t play the music itself. But you get to hear about that whole DIY, like blue collar, I can do this.

I don’t need a big record label. I can do it myself. So for anyone who’s like, should I do this myself?

The way that the New York Hardcore crews used to do this in the 80s is a blueprint for how you can still do it nowadays. That’s a good one. And then there’s another one I like called Sea of Tranquility.

That’s on YouTube. It’s an old webzine that now is a YouTube channel. And they get into everything from jazz fusion, which is some cool stuff, because I never really Jazz is something else I’ve gotten into more recently.

But jazz fusion, I’m still trying to figure it out. Sometimes it’s a little too out of our guard. Sometimes I’m like, it sounds like all the instruments were just thrown down the staircase.

I want to see some sort of glue. But I’m trying. But they also talk about prog rock.

They talk about metal. They talk about modern rock, classic rock. And they have a few shows that are on regular, like every Monday night or Wednesday night.

And really cool characters that he has on there. He has the same people that are basically his friends. But he’ll even have, he’s friends with the drummer from Dream Theater.

So he’ll show up on that show once in a while. And he’ll just, the Dream Theater drummer will be on the show reviewing some music he heard recently that he likes. And you’re like, wow, this guy’s in a major, major prog metal band called Dream Theater that sells out Madison Square Garden.

But he’s on this little podcast called Sia Tranquility as well. So that’s, I recommend that one as well. But those are probably the two main ones.

And I like watching, you know, like, I don’t know how much YouTube stuff you watch. But like when Amoeba does What’s in My Bag, that’s cool. Because that’s that sometimes.

And what I’ll do is I’ll watch that, especially like I watched a Gary Nguyen one, because I’m like, what does he like? Or, or, you know, if some electronic musicians on there, it’ll be a way for me to get exposure to some new artists I’ve never heard before. And then also, I’d like to watch when there’s hip hop artists on there.

Hip hop artists, especially rappers, and like the old school rappers. They listen to so much music, because that’s where they get their samples from and stuff. And you find some really cool gems that I’ve never heard of.

That’s a really popular one. What’s in My Bag from Amoeba. And that’s a really famous record store as well.

But that’s short, right? They’re usually about 10 minutes long. Nice.

I do like that one a lot, because it really helps me get exposure to more music.

[Darran]
Outside of all this music production stuff, and being a teacher, what do you prefer to do when you’re taking a break from all this stuff? What does Michael like to do when he’s like, no music, no school? I’m out.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Well, I’m kind of just chilling, hanging out with my friends. I do listen to a lot of music. I have a family.

I like to hang out with my family. I like watching movies. But yeah, I mean, my day’s pretty full between working full time.

And I don’t, I’m not a teacher. I take classes to learn. I work in a different field as a chemist.

So I do that all day long. Yeah, that’s all right. So that’s a full time job still.

And then yeah, if I’m not composing or listening to music, hanging out with family, I like to go away with my buddies a few times a year if I can. So I try to stay connected with childhood friends, stay connected with family. But I’m pretty laid back kind of guy.

I go to the gym as much as I can. I want to try to live forever. So you got to go to the gym if you want to live forever, perhaps.

[Darran]
Tell me about it. Yeah. I know how that’s, I just weighed in.

I just weighed in at 194 today. And I’m like, whoa, where did this come from? I just put on like 30 pounds over the last three months, four months.

I’m like, where did this come from? Sitting in this chair, in the captain’s chair.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Like I said, my job, even on the campus, I’m mostly doing like desktop research. So I’m like sitting at a computer all day. Yeah.

I got to get up out of the chair and get that.

[Darran]
You got to move.

[Textbook Maneuver]
If you’re in a job like you have or I have. Exactly. I’m not doing hard work like construction where you’re like, you’re getting a workout in as you And I’m a huge foodie too.

[Darran]
So that doesn’t, doesn’t help too much. Yeah. But anyways, you know, Michael, is there anything else you want to let our DJ sessions fans know before we let you go?

[Textbook Maneuver]
Yeah. I mean, I got the distance major just came out on band camp and came out on SoundCloud. Check that out.

Adrenaline slips out on all platforms. You could also find it on band camp and SoundCloud as well. Psytech will be out probably November and then the stuff under my own name.

I will have some remix projects coming up soon. So that’s something I can’t announce yet, but there’s a couple of remix things that might happen. So stay tuned for that.

That, that should help certainly get the word out about who the hell am I? And I’m appreciative that people want to remix my music. That’s even better.

And then I’m trying to get some sync license. I might try to get into film and because it is kind of cinematic. And even when you mentioned like John Cochran and stuff like that, I love the stuff that Hans Zimmer does.

And I was never a huge Nine Inch Nails fan, but some of the stuff Trent Reznor is doing now with film. Yeah, the social network soundtracks, one of my favorite soundtracks, and it’s all really just chill electronic music, but I haven’t seen the new Ninja Turtle. What is that?

The Ninja Turtles, the Teenage Ninja Turtle movie, but the soundtracks done by Trent Reznor. So I downloaded the soundtrack and I’m like, oh, this is awesome. I have no idea what the movie’s about.

[Darran]
I bet you it’s about teenagers that are mutants. It used to be a comic book. Yeah, I know the comic book.

[Textbook Maneuver]
The Teenage Ninja Mutant Turtles.

[Darran]
Teenage Ninja Turtles.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Yeah, so to answer your question though, I wouldn’t mind getting into soundtracking a bit or even just having my music sync there, but I founded Life Science Records originally. When I took that music business course, I said, you know what? I would love to sign local bands, local artists and put out their stuff, but I have no idea how to do that.

And I don’t want to ruin someone’s potential career. So I said to myself, you know what? I’ll do it to myself.

I’ll learn the business myself. If I screw up my music, it’s my only fault. If it takes off, great.

But ultimately I would like Life Science Records to start. I don’t mind doing that A&R stuff all the time. Plus I listen to music all the time.

So that’s another thing in the future. I do want to start signing other artists down the road. So if people are listening and they’re looking for a label, I’m more than happy.

You can get my information at the Bandcamp page, my email’s there and everything too. And that Bandcamp page is…

[Darran]
Boom. There it is. Life Science Records, the number one.bandcamp.com.

Awesome. All right, Michael. Well, thank you so much for coming on the DJ sessions.

Definitely want to follow up with you in the possibly newer artists as well that you’ll be working with. All that and more. Well, it’s a pleasure having you on the show today.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Thank you, Darran. Thanks for having the show. Thanks for having this platform.

It’s people like you that are keeping the music world alive, man.

[Darran]
I appreciate that. Thank you. And we’ll definitely be here for a time to come.

So keep coming back and checking us out. And like I said, we’ll follow up and stay in touch with you in the future as well. All right.

Sounds good, man.

[Textbook Maneuver]
Thank you.

[Darran]
You’re welcome. On that note, don’t forget to go to our website, thedjsessions.com. That’s thedjsessions.com right there. Go to our website, find out all our socials. You can follow us there. See 700 news stories, read 700 news stories, 2700 plus past episodes, live interviews, exclusive mixes, our new music sections being launched here.

We even have a VR nightclub and a mobile app in version two coming out here soon. Version one was out, but we’re revamping it to make it even better. All that and more at thedjsessions.com.

If you’re watching this, snap it with a QR. Somebody just snapped it with a QR code. I saw that happen.

Must be one of our viewers out there. Thank you very much. That was that nice little ring that went around there and said, hey, somebody did this.

Pretty awesome stuff. All that and more at thedjsessions.com. I’m your host, Darran.

That’s Michael, aka Textbook Maneuver for The DJ Sessions. And remember, on The DJ Sessions, the music never stops.